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From Ticking and Tying to Selling Out Arenas: How One Auditor Became EDM Royalty

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A former Big Four auditor traded spreadsheets for turntables and now commands 11.8 million monthly Spotify listeners, sells out Madison Square Garden, and has racked up over two billion career streams. His name is John Summit, and he might just be the most famous accountant in the world.

On a recent episode of The Accounting Podcast, hosts Blake Oliver and David Leary dove into John’s remarkable transformation from EY auditor to global EDM superstar. His career change story captures something profound happening in the accounting profession right now.

From Audit Room to Arena Stage

“If you’re into electronic music, then you know who John Summit is,” Blake explained to David during the episode. 

The numbers tell an incredible story. John—born John Walter Schuster in Naperville, Illinois—followed the traditional accounting path at first. He earned his undergraduate and master’s degrees in accounting from the University of Illinois Urbana-Champaign. From 2018 to 2019, he worked as an auditor at EY in Chicago, starting at $65,000 a year while DJing on weekends.

Blake even pulled up John’s CPA license during the show. “I went to the Illinois Department of Financial and Professional Regulation, and I looked him up by his original name,” he said. The license was active in 2018 and expired in 2022, right around the time John’s music career went stratospheric.

Today, John’s success metrics are staggering. His debut album “Comfort in Chaos” hit number two on the Billboard Top Dance/Electronic Albums chart and cracked the Billboard 200’s top 40. He headlines festivals like Coachella and Tomorrowland, and his own festival, Experts Only, draws 50,000 attendees.

Leaning Into the Accounting Story

What makes John unique is how he’s embraced his accounting past. His new album “CTRL Escape” drops on April 15th, Tax Day, and the cover art shows him sitting atop office ceiling tiles, the corporate world below giving way to open sky above.

“He’s dropping one track from the album every Wednesday,” Blake noted. “And the reason he’s doing it on Wednesday is that he remembers Hump day being the toughest day in the office.”

The album’s merchandise had David cracking up. “Crappy accounting firm swag. This is great,” he said, looking at the offerings. “It’s a backpack that says Summit CPAs, a pen that says Summit CPAs. This is so great he’s leaning into it like that.”

The music video for “Lights Go Out” drives the theme home. John appears in an oversized tan suit at “Summit CPAs,” working at an old green-screen computer before leading his fellow office workers in what Blake described as “basically like an accounting firm turning into a rave.”

The Profession John Left Is Disappearing

Blake and David’s conversation takes a darker turn when they discuss Botkeeper. One of the original “AI bookkeeping” startups announced it was shutting down after 11 years.

“They did the typical tech company ‘fake it ‘til you make it,’” David explained. Botkeeper promised AI-powered bookkeeping but was actually using offshore accountants in the Philippines. When real AI technology finally arrived through companies like OpenAI and Anthropic, investors weren’t interested in funding a company that had burned through capital on the false promise.

It wasn’t just Botkeeper. Jenesys, a UK-based AI bookkeeping startup, also entered a formal sales process after key investors pulled out. Clearly, the old model of pretending to have AI while using human workers is dead.

Meanwhile, companies with actual AI capabilities are thriving. Tax AI startup Accrual raised $75 million, Audit AI startup Fieldguide raised $75 million, and Pilot announced what it called an “AI accountant,” a fully autonomous system capable of running end-to-end bookkeeping with “zero need for human intervention” in typical cases.

Why Tax and Audit AI Are Different

Blake explained why investors are pouring money into tax and audit AI while bookkeeping AI companies struggle.

“When we moved to cloud bookkeeping and accounting, we were able to set up rules-based systems,” he said. “You can still automate 80% of bookkeeping work today with just the old tech.”

But tax and audit are different beasts. “Those areas of accounting were not automatable with rules-based tech, because there are too many gray areas, there’s too much complexity. But AI is starting to handle it really, really, really well.”

To illustrate the point, Blake shared his own experience with Claude, Anthropic’s AI assistant. He gave it access to a folder of scanned documents that his scanner had poorly named and asked it to organize them.

“It created a whole logical folder structure. Different types of files, receipts, legal documents, statements,” he said. “And then it put all the documents into those folders and renamed all the documents based on the content of the PDFs. And it did this in minutes.”

“You can get that if you’re a pro subscriber for like $20 a month. It’s incredible.”

The Entry-Level Jobs Are Vanishing

This AI revolution is having a profound impact on accounting careers. Technology is automating routine tasks that once defined entry-level positions at breakneck speed.

“We’re seeing reductions in entry-level jobs, not reductions in mid-career or later-stage career positions,” Blake observed. “It’s really, really hard to find a tax manager. Nobody can find a tax manager for their public accounting firm.”

The work being automated reads like a first-year auditor’s job description. “Requesting documents from clients, receiving and organizing them, rolling forward prior year workpapers, ticking and tying. AI is starting to do all of that stuff.”

As a result, “it’s really hard to get a job as a staff accountant because nobody wants to train you and they don’t have work to give you to justify the cost of training you for several years.”

Even the Big Four Feel the Pressure

In an ironic twist, even KPMG International is feeling the AI pressure. The firm recently pushed its own auditor, Grant Thornton UK, to lower its audit fee by 14%, arguing that AI-driven efficiencies should reduce costs.

“The negotiations reportedly included pressure tactics, where KPMG threatened to switch auditors if Grant Thornton didn’t agree to a significant reduction,” Blake said, citing Financial Times reporting.

The fee went from $416,000 in 2024 to $357,000 in 2025. As Blake wryly noted: “I think KPMG ought to watch out, because now clients are going to ask for the same fee reduction.”

The Pyramid Is Crumbling

This pressure on fees creates a domino effect. Lower fees mean less money for staff. Fewer entry-level positions mean the traditional pyramid model of public accounting, where large numbers of junior staff support a small number of managers and partners, is collapsing.

“The whole model is going to have to shift,” Blake said. “The pyramid model of accounting is going away. And that’s going to fundamentally change our profession, because that’s been the way everyone got into accounting for a hundred years.”

Blake predicted that within five to ten years, timesheets and time-based billing will disappear entirely. The firms that survive will abandon the old model of counting hours and bodies.

There is a silver lining for those who adapt. Blake shared his own experience. “I saw a 5x increase in my revenue just as a freelancer” after embracing cloud technology. His effective hourly rate went from $20 to $100, and his workload actually decreased.

The Escape Route Is Closing

John Summit celebrates his escape from accounting through music that resonates with millions who understand the cubicle grind. He drops tracks on Wednesdays because that was the hardest day to push through. He releases albums on Tax Day. He sells fake accounting firm swag as merchandise.

But the entry-level accounting experience he’s immortalizing—the fluorescent lights, the routine tasks, the path that led him from college to Big Four—is rapidly disappearing. Future accountants may never know that particular grind because the jobs simply won’t exist.

Accounting will likely survive with higher earnings for those who remain and adapt. But the traditional path into the profession will evolve.

As David suggested during the show, if you’re Summit CPAs—a real accounting firm that happens to share the name—you might want to figure out how to capitalize on all the traffic coming your way. Because in a profession being reshaped by AI, you need to grab opportunities wherever you find them.

For the complete discussion of John’s journey, the AI transformation of accounting, and what it means for the profession’s future, listen to the full episode of The Accounting Podcast.

Your Most Trusted Employee Is Your Biggest Fraud Risk

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If you’re an accountant cramming in your last CPE credits while reading this, Caleb Newquist has a message for you: “Have fun. You’re in for something.”

The host of Oh My Fraud just wrapped up 2025 with 26 episodes of financial fraud stories that share one depressing pattern: they were completely preventable. In episode 101, Caleb and co-producer Zach Frank sat down to recap a year that started with co-host Greg Kyte’s departure and continued with tales of embezzlement, gambling addictions, and presidential pardons.

The biggest takeaway? The person most likely to steal from you isn’t some sophisticated hacker. It’s the assistant who sets up your bank accounts, the business manager you’ve trusted for years, or the administrator who’s been ordering computers for decades.

When Your Interpreter Controls Your Bank Account

The year’s most talked-about fraud case involved baseball superstar Shohei Ohtani and his interpreter, Ippei Mizuhara. The setup was almost embarrassingly simple. Ippei handled everything when setting up Ohtani’s bank account during spring training in Arizona: the setup, the passcodes, and the access. Ohtani himself couldn’t access his own money. Neither could his business manager.

“Don’t let your assistant set up your account for you,” Zach emphasized during the recap. The only person who could touch that money was the interpreter who eventually stole from it.

The DOJ charging documents revealed desperate text messages between Ippei and his bookie. When the bookie suggested Ippei might be covering for Ohtani, Ippei insisted, “No, this was all me.” He made phone calls to the bank pretending to be Ohtani, claiming he was buying cars while actually funneling money to cover massive gambling debts.

Ippei is now serving time at Allenwood in Pennsylvania, after which he’ll be deported. Lionsgate TV and Stars are developing a series about the scandal, because apparently financial disasters go great with a side of popcorn.

The Business Manager Who Managed Beyoncé (Before the Fraud)

Episode 81 was the podcast’s most popular of the year, featuring an interview with Jonathan Todd Schwartz. Before stealing $7 million from Alanis Morissette, Schwartz managed finances for Beyoncé and Gwyneth Paltrow, back before they became the cultural forces they are today.

“Everyone loves hearing from the person who committed the crime and hearing why and how they committed the crime,” Zach noted. Schwartz’s story connected directly to another recurring theme of 2025: the devastating combination of gambling and drug addictions creating pressure that makes theft seem like the only solution.

Both the Ohtani and Morissette cases featured one person with total financial control and zero independent oversight. They’re failures of basic internal controls that any first-year accounting student could spot.

When Yale Lost $40 Million in Computers (And Nobody Noticed)

If celebrity cases seem distant from everyday fraud risk, consider Yale Medical School. An administrator within the finance function stole approximately $40 million in computer equipment over several years by simply keeping purchases under $10,000 to avoid triggering review thresholds.

“Forty million dollars should replace every computer at that entire school,” Zach pointed out. “Not just the medical school, like all of Yale.”

The university’s multi-billion dollar endowment meant these losses barely registered as statistical noise. As Caleb noted, Yale wasn’t exactly a sympathetic victim, “but that doesn’t mean you should steal $40 million worth of computers and sell them on the black market.”

The solution was painfully obvious. Omri from Routable (the podcast’s sponsor) summed it up in an earlier bonus episode: “A procurement process probably solves that problem.” Not revolutionary thinking; just basic purchasing controls that require someone other than the person ordering equipment to also receive and verify it.

The Columbus Zoo Plays Hardball

The Columbus Zoo case from episode 79 showed what happens when organizations decide to fight back. After executives were convicted of misspending and stealing funds, the zoo didn’t stop at criminal prosecution. They sued three executives to foreclose on their homes, determined to recover restitution.

The case came to light thanks to investigative reporting by the Columbus Dispatch, a reminder that journalism often serves as the last line of defense when internal controls fail. It’s a pattern that repeated throughout 2025: local reporters doing the unglamorous work of following paper trails and asking tough questions.

The Mental Gymnastics Olympics

Understanding how fraud happens mechanically is one thing. Understanding why people convince themselves it’s okay is another entirely.

Carlos Watson’s Ozy Media case pushed rationalization to its limits. Watson, who was convicted of fraud but subsequently pardoned by President Trump (with his restitution expunged), reportedly did “whatever it took” to make his business succeed. The SEC decided not to pursue further civil litigation after the pardon.

“The mental gymnastics that guy must have been going through in order to rationalize what he was doing,” Caleb observed. “Weird, but impressive.”

The Spotify streaming fraud case included another common justification: “Who am I really stealing from?” Perpetrators faking streams saw themselves taking from faceless tech giants rather than individual artists. The same logic appeared in cases involving fake invoices to Google and Facebook.

Where Are They Now? The 2025 Updates

Beyond the new cases, the year brought updates on ongoing sagas:

  • Mair Smyth, the con artist featured in Johnathan Walton’s episode was sentenced to four years in UK prison for mortgage fraud. Walton helped Northern Ireland authorities locate her. He flew to the UK for the trial but remains frustrated by what he sees as a light sentence for a career criminal.
  • First NBC Bank. A listener from New Orleans shared a local rumor that the bank’s massive Directors & Officers insurance policy allowed CEO Ashton Ryan to draw out his legal proceedings for seven years before finally being sentenced. He’s now in a prison infirmary.
  • Miriam Baer, the podcast’s first guest of 2025, left Brooklyn Law School to become Dean and President at California Western School of Law in San Diego.
  • The Rare Book Find. Caleb tracked down a copy of Australian con man Johann Friedrich Hohenberger’s ghost-written autobiography at a Maryland rare book store. When he apologized for taking months to complete the purchase, the seller reassured him, “In the rare books business, this was actually fast.”

What 2025 Taught Us (Again)

The year’s cases delivered a maddeningly consistent message: basic controls work, but only if you actually use them. Whether it’s a baseball star’s interpreter, a rock legend’s business manager, or a university administrator, the pattern never changes.

“The classics constantly get covered because people are going to constantly fall for them and commit those crimes,” Zach summarized. Ponzi schemes, embezzlement, and wire fraud are not going anywhere.

For accounting professionals, it’s crucial to maintain skepticism about single-person financial control. It’s not paranoia; it’s professional responsibility. Those boring internal controls you learned about in school are boring because they work.

Want the full conversation, including discussions about whether crypto is just one giant Ponzi scheme, why procurement departments exist, and how the hosts feel about having to do it all over again in 2026, listen to episode 101 of Oh My Fraud.

Because if you’re going to learn about fraud, you might as well learn from people who can make you laugh about it, even if the punchline involves prison sentences and presidential pardons.

Inside the Innovation Circle: Three Days of Conversations at Intuit Connect

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After three days of walking around the Innovation Circle at Intuit Connect and filling 27 pages of Field Notes, it’s clear that QuickBooks is transforming from accounting software into a complete business operating system.

That’s the takeaway from a recent episode of The Unofficial QuickBooks Accountants Podcast, where hosts Alicia Katz Pollock, MAT, and Dan DeLong wrap up their three-part series covering Intuit Connect, where Alicia skipped the workshops to spend her time talking directly with developers in the Innovation Circle.

Keep in mind that these conversations occurred three months before the episode aired. So Alicia notes, “A lot of the things they said are coming soon might have already been released. So the timelines are kind of vague on a lot of these.”

What isn’t vague is where Intuit is heading. From AI-powered construction project management to sophisticated bill-approval workflows, the platform is expanding across every corner of business operations. For accounting professionals, understanding this evolution is the difference between being a bookkeeper and becoming a strategic business advisor.

Construction Gets Industry-Specific Tools in Enterprise Suite

Alicia’s conversation with Uttam Ramamurthy, Principal Engineer – AI Builder at Intuit, revealed how Intuit Enterprise Suite is tackling construction accounting, one of their key mid-market targets. They’re building specialized tools that actually understand construction workflows.

The familiar project list with profitability stripes is becoming a full dashboard designed for construction companies. You can set default margin goals, such as 25% profit on all projects, and the system alerts you when profitability falls below your threshold. As Alicia explained, “If you fall below your profit margin settings, it alerts you and gives you a heads up when your profitability is too low.”

The AI capabilities show real promise. Upload your project notes, and the system auto-populates project details and phases. It pulls from your documentation and uses what Intuit calls “AI product knowledge from similar projects” to suggest project structure.

Other construction features in development include:

  • Upload spreadsheets directly into project budgets (finally bridging the gap between estimating spreadsheets and QuickBooks)
  • Create product and service lists with quantities and unit costs, grouped by phases and cost groups
  • Show collapsible estimate views where customers see clean phase summaries while you keep line-item detail
  • Build graphic proposals with text blocks, photos, before/after images, and testimonials
  • Take deposits from estimates with proper liability accounting

That deposit feature comes with a warning. Alicia tested it three times during a recent class. It worked once but failed twice to properly subtract the deposit when converting to invoices. “I’m not sure if it’s still in development or not working, or if it’s just my cookies on my computer preventing it from working,” she admitted.

The platform now supports AIA progress billing, addressing a major gap for firms with architect and government contracts. As Dan observed, “The devil is always in the details as far as how it actually looks, but they understand those workflows.”

You can even mark project phases as complete via text message to automatically generate invoices. When projects close, Intuit Enterprise Suite creates a summary with lessons learned, profitability reports, and outstanding transactions, essentially a built-in project post-mortem.

For construction companies with multiple entities (common with separate LLCs for different projects), Intuit Enterprise Suite offers consolidated views across companies with shared charts of accounts, vendors, dimensions, and customers. You can create entity groups and filter views to specific business segments.

Mailchimp Integration Powers Marketing from Your Financial Data

The Mailchimp integration shows how seriously Intuit takes the connection between accounting and marketing. After all, your QuickBooks already knows who your customers are and what they buy. So why not use that for targeted marketing?

Alicia shared an example from her own business. When Intuit announces price increases, she needs to notify clients on wholesale QuickBooks plans where she pays for their subscriptions. She creates a Mailchimp segment where “product or service equals wholesale QuickBooks,” finds everyone affected, and sends targeted emails, all driven by her accounting data.

Stephen Yu, CPA and Product Manager at Intuit, walked Alicia through upcoming enhancements that will connect additional platforms. Soon, you’ll see email campaign success alongside data from Shopify, Stripe, PayPal, Square, and Wix on a single dashboard.

Other Mailchimp features coming soon include:

  • Click maps showing where recipients engage in your emails
  • Audience dashboards tracking growth by channel (Meta, Google, website forms, manual imports)
  • Revenue attribution connecting sales to specific campaigns
  • Journey tracking from page views through cart additions to checkout
  • Send time optimization revealing best days and times
  • AI-generated performance digests with recommended actions
  • Drag-and-drop templates that auto-generate newsletters from blog content (targeted for 2026)

ProAdvisors get Mailchimp discounts based on their tier level. The higher your tier, the better the pricing. Though Dan noted these discounts do expire.

What impressed Dan was Intuit’s patient approach to integration. “They’re not taking Mailchimp things and putting them in QuickBooks or taking QuickBooks things and putting them in Mailchimp. They are truly putting them on the same level. It’s a lot more polished than what we’ve seen in the past.”

The platform is also adding SMS messaging capabilities and, potentially, WhatsApp integration, expanding beyond email to meet customers where they communicate.

Customer Hub Becomes a Real CRM System

Christina Stansbury, Principal Product Marketer at Intuit, showed Alicia how the Customer Hub is evolving into a true customer relationship management system. Alicia already covered this development extensively in a previous episode, Customer Leads Hubba-Hubba.

You can now embed contact forms directly on your website and route inquiries into QuickBooks. The AI “customer agent” scans your Gmail to surface inquiries about your services and automatically convert them into leads.

The lead management system offers both list and Kanban views that visualize your pipeline from inquiry through discovery, negotiation, and closing. The system suggests next steps: draft an email, create an estimate, or book a site visit.

Other communication features built into Customer Hub include:

  • Emails sent through your Gmail (appearing completely natural to recipients)
  • Calendar integration for appointment scheduling
  • Self-scheduling links for customers
  • Video calls with automatic transcription (no recording, but searchable transcripts)
  • Mobile app integration for site visits with voice recordings, images, and notes

The mobile app deserves special mention. Dan highlighted how Intuit overhauled it to mirror the desktop experience. “The terminology changes on the web version found their way pretty quickly to the mobile app, which I appreciate.”

Coming soon: a proposal builder that pulls from your lead notes, emails, and conversations to generate polished documents connected to customer data. As with Intuit Enterprise Suite proposals, professionals can collect signatures and deposits directly from the proposal.

Bill Pay Gets Enterprise-Level Sophistication

The bill pay evolution addresses both processing efficiency and compliance requirements. You can email bills to a custom intuit.com email address or drag multiple documents into the business feed.

The current limitation is line-item detail. As Alicia explained to Abby Chu, Staff Marketing Manager at Intuit, the system reliably captures vendor names and dates but struggles with individual line items. Intuit is building machine learning to address this. Eventually, it will prompt you to create rules.

This creates what Alicia called a chicken-and-egg problem. “If it doesn’t work, people can’t use it. But if we don’t use it, then they can’t build the AI generator to make it work.”

Fees vary by payment speed:

  • Standard: 3 days (free)
  • Faster: 1 day ($10)
  • Instant: Minutes (1% fee, $100 maximum)

That instant option with the capped fee is noteworthy because you can pay a large urgent bill for just $100.

Bill Pay Elite introduces sophisticated approval workflows with full segregation of duties. You must have different people as bill clerk, approver, and payer—no overlap allowed. Approval conditions can stack up to seven levels deep, with complex if/then logic based on vendor, amount, and products.

Future enhancements include group approvals (any team member can approve), delegation for out-of-office situations, and audit history tracking workflow changes.

For bookkeepers managing multiple clients, Intuit Accountant Suite provides an eagle-eye view of bills across your entire client base. You’ll soon see available cash balances to prevent bounced payments.

But Alicia offered an important caveat about high-level views. During year-end cleanup, she discovered a client paying both personal and business electricity bills from the company card—something only visible at the transaction level. “There are some times when the eagle eyes still don’t give us the details on the ground view,” she noted.

Lending Services Leverage Your Financial Data

QuickBooks now incorporates Credit Karma’s embedded lending capabilities. Think of it like LendingTree built into your accounting software.

For loans under $250,000, Intuit offers direct lending. Above that, they connect you with third-party lenders. The system evaluates your credit score and business history to provide terms with no origination fees or prepayment penalties, although interest rates vary based on creditworthiness.

For customers, there’s a toggle in settings (currently defaulted on) that offers financing on large estimates. As Alicia explained, “If one of your potential customers turns down your bid because they have cash flow issues, then you may be able to win the engagement by offering them financing.”

On the collections side, you can now require auto-pay for recurring invoices. Looking ahead, customers will have their own dashboard to manage payments across all QuickBooks-using vendors. Update a credit card once, and it applies everywhere.

The Platform Evolution Continues

After three episodes covering Intuit Connect, Alicia concludes, “Intuit is really true to their mantra of powering prosperity around the world. They’re trying to help us increase revenue and improve cash flow. Having the data and insights to see what’s happening beyond just running a P&L and balance sheet is really super helpful.”

The challenge for accounting professionals is keeping up. Even Intuit’s own sales teams struggle to understand the full platform. Dan shared his frustration with telesales agents who don’t realize what Intuit Enterprise Suite offers, requiring multiple handoffs to get clients the right information.

But the opportunities are substantial for those who embrace the platform’s evolution. You can offer advisory services around marketing analytics, design approval workflows, guide construction clients through industry-specific tools, and advise on embedded lending options.

QuickBooks will continue transforming. Will you be the advisor helping clients navigate these new capabilities or the one still explaining why they need separate software for everything?

Listen to the full episode to learn more. And remember, as Dan and Alicia noted, they’re “almost ready for the next Intuit Connect to do this all again.”

Alicia Katz Pollock’s Royalwise OWLS (On-Demand Web-based Learning Solutions) is the industry’s premier portal for top-notch QuickBooks Online training with CPE for accounting firms, bookkeepers, and small business owners. Visit Royalwise OWLS, where learning QBO is a HOOT!

This $600,000 Lesson Proves You Can’t Outsource Your Filing Deadline

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Wayne Lee, a Florida surgeon, hired CPA Kevin Walsh to prepare and file his tax returns. From 2014 through 2016, Wayne provided Kevin with all necessary documents and signed Form 8879 e-file authorizations each year. As far as Wayne knew, Kevin was doing exactly what he’d been hired to do: preparing and filing returns, each showing mid-six-figure tax liabilities but also substantial refunds due.

Wayne discovered the truth on December 5, 2018, when an IRS agent showed up at his office. Kevin had never filed any of those returns. He’d never told Wayne about a software issue that supposedly prevented e-filing. The IRS notices had piled up at an incorrect address that Kevin promised but failed to update. By the time Wayne discovered the problem, the three-year statute of limitations had expired on his $288,000 refund from 2014. Instead of rolling that refund forward as planned, Wayne ended up paying $289,000 to the IRS in 2019 to settle unpaid liabilities, penalties, and interest.

Wayne sued Kevin (settling out of court) and the federal government for a refund. The government won.

In a recent episode of Tax in Action, host Jeremy Wells, CPA, EA, uses Wayne’s case to explore a principle the Supreme Court established decades ago: you can delegate tax return preparation, but you can’t delegate responsibility for filing deadlines. Understanding this distinction and the penalties that follow when taxpayers miss deadlines is crucial for tax professionals and their clients.

How Failure to File and Failure to Pay Penalties Work

The penalties Wayne faced were calculated additions to tax that accrued interest and turned a potentially manageable balance into a serious financial burden.

The failure to file penalty under IRC Section 6651(a)(1) is the more severe of the two delinquency penalties. It’s 5% of the net amount due for each month or fraction of a month the return is late. That “fraction of a month” language carries real weight. File your return one day late, and you owe a full month’s penalty. The penalty maxes out at 25% of the net amount due, unless fraud is involved. In fraud cases, the penalty jumps to 15% per month with a 75% ceiling.

“The net amount due means the tax liability shown on the return less any withholding credits, estimated payments, or any other payments made on or before the due date,” Wells explains, emphasizing a critical point. This definition, from IRC Section 6651(b)(1), means even if you can’t file on time, making payments  reduces the base amount for penalty calculations.

The failure to pay penalty under IRC Section 6651(a)(2) is gentler at 0.5% per month, but it comes with its own trap. As Wells explains, “An extension of time to file is never an extension of time to pay.” Treasury Regulation 1.6081-4(c) makes this explicit. That six-month extension gives you time to finish the paperwork, not time to find the money.

When both penalties apply, as in the case of an unfiled return with an unpaid balance, they don’t stack. The failure to file penalty gets reduced by the failure to pay amount, keeping the combined rate at 5% per month. But both count as “additions to tax,” meaning interest accrues on the penalties themselves, compounding the total amount owed over time.

The math drives the strategy. As Wells puts it, “Why pay 5% when you only have to pay 0.5%?” Always file on time, even with a balance due. Always request extensions if you need more preparation time. And make estimated payments before April 15th to reduce the net amount due that serves as the penalty base.

Partnerships and S Corporations Face Different Rules

Pass-through entities don’t pay income tax directly, so there’s no failure to pay penalty. But their failure to file penalties can be devastating.

Under IRC Sections 6698 (partnerships) and 6699 (S corporations), the penalty is an inflation-indexed amount per partner or shareholder, per month the return is late. For 2025, that’s $245 per partner or shareholder, increasing to $255 in 2026 and $260 in 2027.

Wells stresses the multiplication effect. “By definition, a partnership has at least two partners. So if you have a late 1065, then at a minimum, the penalty will be doubled.” A small partnership with four partners and a three-month late filing would owe nearly $3,000 in penalties for 2025.

The penalty amount is determined by the year the return should be filed, not the tax year of the return. So if you file a 2024 partnership return late in 2025, you use the 2025 penalty amount.

Relying on Your Tax Professional Won’t Save You

Wayne’s defense seemed reasonable. He hired a licensed CPA, signed e-file authorizations, provided all documents, and was repeatedly assured his returns were being handled. Surely that demonstrates ordinary business care?

The courts said no, following precedent from United States v. Boyle (1985). In that case, the Supreme Court reversed an appeals court that sided with a taxpayer whose attorney missed an estate tax filing deadline. The Supreme Court held that taxpayers cannot delegate filing and payment deadlines to professionals.

When Wayne’s case reached the 11th Circuit in 2023, his attorneys argued that e-filing changes this dynamic. If only the professional can electronically submit returns, doesn’t that shift responsibility? The court rejected this argument entirely. “E-filing does not change the taxpayer’s duty,” they ruled.

So what actually qualifies as reasonable cause? The IRS outlines acceptable categories in Internal Revenue Manual 20.1.1.3.2:

  • Death or serious illness of the taxpayer, immediate family member, or key employee within an organization (not an outside professional)
  • Fire, casualty, or natural disaster directly causing non-compliance
  • Legitimate inability to obtain essential records after reasonable efforts (poor recordkeeping doesn’t count)
  • Reliance on erroneous written IRS advice specifically addressing your situation
  • Ignorance of the law, but only if you had no prior filing requirement, tried to learn the law, and the issue was genuinely complex

Wells notes a crucial limitation: if you’re “demonstrably competent enough to carry on other transactions,” like hiring and working with a tax professional, “reasonable cause won’t work.”

The message is clear: tax professionals can prepare returns and provide advice, but the legal duty to ensure filing and payment remains with the taxpayer.

First-Time Abatement Is Your Best Shot at Relief

While reasonable cause rarely succeeds, taxpayers have another option that’s often more accessible: First-Time Abatement (FTA).

The IRS evaluates penalty relief requests in a specific order, outlined in IRM Chapter 20:

  1. Correction of IRS error
  2. Statutory and regulatory exceptions
  3. Administrative waivers (including FTA)
  4. Reasonable cause

Notice that FTA comes before reasonable cause, even though reasonable cause is statutory. The National Taxpayer Advocate has criticized this ordering, but for taxpayers, it creates opportunity.

FTA covers failure to file, failure to pay, and failure to deposit penalties, but not the underpayment penalty. To qualify, you need:

  • Clean penalty history for three prior years (no unreversed penalties)
  • All required returns filed
  • Tax paid or payment arrangement in place

A critical change occurred in March 2023. “If you have a taxpayer with a relatively small penalty and you don’t ask for first time abatement, and then the following year they get an even bigger penalty, first time abatement is not available because it should have been used on that first penalty,” Wells explains. 

The old strategy of “saving” FTA for a potentially larger future penalty no longer works. Use it when you’re eligible, or lose it.

Timing matters for requesting FTA. You can’t abate a penalty before it’s assessed, so wait for the notice—typically a CP14 or CP162. Get Form 8821 or 2848 authorization from clients and check the box to have notices forwarded to your office. When the notice arrives, respond immediately or call the Practitioner Priority Service for faster resolution.

Good news is coming: the National Taxpayer Advocate announced that starting with tax year 2025 returns, the IRS will begin automatically applying FTA to eligible penalties. Until then, it remains a manual process.

Protecting Yourself and Your Clients

“Penalty abatement is really less about proving innocence and more about understanding the timing, the procedures and how the IRS operates,” Wells says to summarize the episode’s overarching message. 

For tax professionals, this means building clear communication into every client engagement. Clients must understand that while you prepare returns, they’re still responsible for confirming filing and payment. This isn’t about avoiding responsibility; it’s about accurately representing how tax law works.

Wayne Lee did everything a reasonable person would do, yet still lost nearly $600,000. His case is a reminder that in tax compliance, good intentions and professional help aren’t enough. The responsibility to file and pay on time ultimately rests with the taxpayer, and they can’t delegate that duty.

Listen to the full episode of Tax in Action for Jeremy’s’ complete analysis of IRC Section 6651, including detailed penalty calculations and step-by-step guidance for requesting abatement.

The Accounting Profession Is Growing—So Why Can’t New Graduates Find Jobs?

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Something strange is happening in accounting right now. The profession is growing, with employment for accountants projected to increase by 10% through 2026, faster than most other careers. Yet new accounting graduates are struggling to find jobs. How can both things be true at the same time?

In a recent episode of The Accounting Podcast, hosts Blake Oliver and David Leary tackled this paradox head-on, sparked by a sobering prediction from Anthropic CEO Dario Amodei: AI could displace 50% of entry-level white-collar jobs in the next one to five years.

“Accountants coming out of school are having a hard time getting jobs right now, which is strange,” Blake said during the discussion. “The profession is growing, but entry-level jobs are declining.”

The reason behind that paradox is AI is automating exactly the kind of work that new accountants traditionally cut their teeth on. And that’s creating a bigger problem than just unemployment. It’s threatening the way accountants have learned their craft for generations.

The Work That’s Disappearing

Think about what entry-level accountants actually do (or used to do). They gather documents for audits and organize them into folders. They copy last year’s work papers and update them with new numbers. They reconcile accounts, enter data, and basically do the grunt work that teaches them how financial information flows through a business.

These aren’t exciting tasks, but they serve a purpose. By doing this work, new accountants develop an eye for what looks right and what doesn’t. They learn where errors hide and build intuition.

Now, AI is making all of that work disappear.

During the episode, Blake described Anthropic’s new Claude Cowork feature. It’s AI that can literally click around on your computer as a human would. In one example, a journalist asked it to organize a messy folder of business receipts. The AI asked a few questions about how to sort them, then went to work. Five minutes later, it produced a clean Excel spreadsheet listing two years of expenses.

“File management, organizing folders, batch renaming, generating summary spreadsheets,” Blake noted. This is exactly the kind of work that used to take hours of a staff accountant’s time.

The capabilities keep expanding. Claude now has an Excel integration that lets you skip learning formulas entirely. Need to split a column with full names into separate first and last name columns? Just type what you want in plain English.

“All the Excel wizards are going to be in trouble,” David joked, “because I’ll be able to type in ‘put two more columns, first name, last name separately,’ and it’ll go do the formula for me.”

Another striking example is that Gusto now lets you run payroll directly through ChatGPT. Just type “@Gusto, help me run payroll” and have a conversation. No separate login or clicking through menus—just chat.

Where Do New Graduates Go Now?

This automation creates a problem that goes way beyond individual job losses. Most accountants start their careers in public accounting, doing exactly this kind of entry-level work. That’s how they learn the skills they’ll need to become managers and partners later on.

“Where do accounting graduates go to get their first jobs if they don’t go into public accounting?” Blake asked. “Who’s going to want to hire them?”

The challenge is that new graduates don’t have the experience to do the mid-career jobs that are actually in demand. They can’t review work they’ve never done themselves. As David put it, “They don’t have the skills to monitor AI yet, or know when AI is wrong.”

Workers sense this shift happening. According to a survey mentioned by CFO.com, 60% of U.S. adults believe AI will eliminate more jobs than it creates by 2026. Only 16% think AI could never replace what they do.

This fear is already changing behavior. Last year, 51% of workers said they’d quit if their company demanded a return to the office. This year, that number crashed to just 7%.

“The pendulum has swung back to employers,” Blake observed. “Employers have the power in the market.”

The Industry Starts to Respond

Some companies are beginning to tackle this problem, though it’s unclear if their efforts will be enough.

Intuit announced its most ambitious initiative so far: a program to upskill 1 million accounting students over the next five years. They’re focusing on “digital data and advisory skills,” basically teaching students to work alongside AI rather than compete with it.

The program includes online learning, mentorship, and certifications like QuickBooks ProAdvisor. It kicked off with a virtual event in early February about “Skills for the New Era of Accounting.”

But beyond formal programs, the hosts suggested that individual accountants need to change how they think about their work entirely.

“The most important skill in the AI era is going to be curiosity,” Blake argued.

He shared a practical tip for working with AI. Instead of trying to write the perfect prompt, have the AI ask you questions. His go-to addition to any request is, “First, ask me questions to clarify exactly what I’m looking for. After each of my answers, reply with your next question. Include a confidence score as a percentage. When you achieve 100% confidence, ask me to confirm I am ready for you to do the task.”

David added another crucial insight. “That ‘please wait until I say go’ is the most important prompt.” Without explicit instructions to wait, AI tools tend to race ahead with incomplete information.

A Paradox for Payroll Companies

The episode raised an interesting question about companies like ADP, which announced new AI agents for payroll and HR tasks. These agents can audit for errors, flag missing tax IDs, and answer HR questions using company handbooks.

But as David pointed out, there’s something odd about payroll companies embracing AI so enthusiastically. “If you believe AI is going to be important, that’s going to kill millions and millions of these jobs that get paid through ADP,” he said. If AI eliminates 50% of entry-level jobs, that’s potentially half of ADP’s revenue from running payroll.

Paychex mentioned AI 50 times in their recent earnings call. Investors are clearly asking hard questions about how payroll companies will survive if their customer base of employed humans shrinks dramatically.

What Happens Next?

The tools reshaping accounting are here now. Claude can organize receipts. ChatGPT can run payroll. AI agents can audit for errors. Every month brings new capabilities that used to require human hands and human hours.

The mismatch is striking. Technology advances in months, while professional training evolves over years or decades. Universities design programs on multi-year cycles. Firms have hiring patterns built over generations. Everyone assumes the entry-level work that has trained accountants forever will continue to exist.

That assumption is crumbling. The document gathering, data entry, and reconciliations are becoming prompts typed into AI interfaces rather than skills learned through repetition.

For firms, this means rethinking how new hires develop competence. For educators, it means teaching students to verify and question rather than just execute. For students and early-career professionals, it means learning to supervise technology rather than compete with it.

As Blake put it near the end of the episode, “I can be ten times as productive now doing everything I do with AI, and I don’t need to hire a huge team to do it.”

That’s great news for experienced professionals who already know their craft. For those just starting out, it’s an entirely different story—one the profession is only beginning to write.

Listen to the full episode of The Accounting Podcast for more insights on AI tools reshaping accounting workflows, practical prompting techniques, and updates from Intuit, Xero, ADP, and other platforms. Understanding how AI affects entry-level work is table stakes for anyone making decisions about talent and training in the years ahead.